The Local Lads

This week Sam Hamblin and Ed White, owners of Essex based menswear business The Local Merchants join me to discuss the highs and lows of entrepreneurship and what it's like to grow a business with your best mate. 

The Local Merchants website is here; https://thelocalmerchants.co.uk/

Follow The Local Merchants on Instagram here: https://www.instagram.com/thelocalmerchants?utm_source=ig_web_button_share_sheet&igsh=ZDNlZDc0MzIxNw==

The JobsWorth website is here www.jobs-worth.com

Watch the show on YouTube; https://www.youtube.com/@jobsworthpodcast

Follow the show on Instagram; https://www.instagram.com/jobsworthpodcast/?hl=en

Follow me on LinkedIn; https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnhawker/

Follow me on TikTok; https://www.tiktok.com/@globaltechcollective

Subscribe to my newsletter 'The Job Journal from GTC'; https://subscribepage.io/TheJobJournal

Learn more about my proper job; https://www.globaltechcollective.com/

Contact the show on hello@jobs-worth.com

Transcript

Friendship & Business in Menswear

Speaker 1 0:00

That's amazing innit. Oh mate, do you know what?

Speaker 2 0:02

I had the window open and the. I've been farting in here on my own all day. I was. You know when you're very conscious about the musk that you're leaving behind.

Speaker 3 0:11

That's what our shop's like, Is it?

Speaker 1 0:14

Yeah, it does yeah yeah yeah, smarts of shit and whatever aftershave everyone's.

Speaker 3 0:19

You didn't say everyone is it? Yeah, yeah exactly. Oh, he smells of shit in the air. That's how. I smell Cheers.

Speaker 2 0:26

Cheers. Thanks for having us man, don't be silly.

Speaker 2 0:29

Jobsworth season 2, episode 10 the local lads. Welcome to episode 10 of Jobsworth season 2. It's double trouble once again this week as I sit down with Sam Hamblin and Ed White, owners of the Local Merchants, a menswear business based in Lyon Sea. Sam and Ed met at school and, as you'll come to learn, they've been inseparable ever since. We discussed their experience of school how they first developed their love of fashion, how that was perceived by their mates and how their sense of style has evolved over the years, too.

Speaker 2 1:13

Despite heading down different paths after leaving education, sam and Ed's friendship never faltered, and you could almost say it was fated that the two of them would one day bring their very particular sets of skills to bear on their own venture. Before that, though, we look back at their earlier careers and the experiences that would ultimately lead them to setting up shop in the heart of Leon C. Running a business with your best mate it's not for everyone, but Sam and Ed just seem to make it work. We explored a secret to their successful collaboration the importance of transparency and the value of playing to your strengths. I also find out why it's so important to build genuine relationships with your customers and how that shapes their approach to customer service.

Speaker 2 1:52

The Local Merchants has just celebrated its second anniversary In a sector that can be notoriously hard to crack. Salmonhead's business has become firmly entrenched in the local area, and whilst they're officially outsiders don't tell anyone, though this comedy duo have been welcomed by the community with open arms. So, without further ado, let me introduce you to the two new kids on the block in leon c and two of the nicest, most authentic guys you're likely to meet, sam and ed. So the opening question on the podcast. If you've listened to three, sam, you'll know, and ed if you remember the one you listened to you'll know as well so the opening question is always when you were younger, what did you want to be when you grew up?

Speaker 1 2:31

so, ed, I'm going to start with you you start with me yes, I mean, we've already had this sort of conversation ourselves. Um, but really I have never had an idea of what I wanted to do. Okay, like just sort of floated and I don't know. Really, it's just like a lot of pressure put on like that question what do you want to do? And it was just like from school I went to university and all of that. And still at that point was like Still didn't know, yeah, yeah, and then I sort of ran away and went travelling.

Speaker 3 3:09

Yeah, just abandoned it all and just yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 3:13

So when you were a kid, no aspirations, no dreams. You were just sort of sold on the fact that you just didn't have a dream.

Speaker 1 3:23

I mean my dad. He was a, an insurance underwriter. He had a very successful business, um, I went to work, uh, for him for a bit, um, and from that I was just, I didn't. It was really hard for following in my dad's footsteps, sort of thing. That was the like oh my god, I can't do this. Like um. So I was like I need to go to university, because that's what people do, um, or that's what I thought, and I, uh, I went to university and I still was a bit like well, I wanted to be an architect, ended up doing buildings of van. Okay, uh, got a two one and I was like right, okay, let's put this into practice. And went straight in to do land management. And from there I uh was like this is incredibly boring, I'm not getting anything out of it, and um was like I can't do this for the rest of my life.

Speaker 2 4:15

So I went traveling right, we're going to pick that back up and we can talk a bit more about your um adventures oh yeah, so seems happy about that. Gone in sam, what did you? Did you have any dreams when you were?

Speaker 3 4:29

young. I don't want to uh, you know, upset you, but it's pretty much the same oh for fuck's, no no, I'll tell you what. No, I'll tell you what it was. I've always got away with just doing the bare minimum. I've sort of plodded through school.

Speaker 3 4:43

I come from, like my family, are very academic okay my mum was a special needs advisor teacher as well, for special needs children. My dad was a teacher. He's retired now as well. So I always sort of thought I was going to go down that route. Okay, I just thought, yeah, that's. You know, my parents do it and they're bloody good at it. So have you got brothers and sisters? Yeah, yeah, I've got a brother. Um, he's doing a phd at the moment.

Speaker 2 5:10

Um, so that's what I mean.

Speaker 3 5:11

They're all academics, yeah um, my sister is a child therapist. Um, yeah, so I'm like the black sheep of the family. I was the artistic one, right? Um, I went to sixth form. I got kicked out of sixth form because my attendance was not well, I didn't go okay, and then I took a year off.

Speaker 3 5:32

I worked in JD sports. Then I went to college to do music technology in Colchester Institute. I enjoyed it a lot, but then I started realising there weren't really no dough in it. So now I've become a forklift driver okay, for UK Mail, which is now owned by DHL. Enjoyed it a lot, but then I started realising there weren't really no dough in it, right. So then I became a forklift driver Okay, for UK Mail, which is now owned by DHL, and I worked in Braintree.

Speaker 1 5:51

Was that a plug then? Huh, you plug in DHL.

Speaker 3 5:53

Yeah, yeah, big up DHL, yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 5:55

Tony, we're looking for sponsors. Actually it's not relevant.

Speaker 3 6:00

My delivery driver, Tony is the best in the business. I'll put a word in for you. And then from there, mate, yeah, went into menswear. Okay, so I started doing menswear when I was like 22, just doing a full-time job as a sales associate.

Speaker 2 6:16

Right.

Speaker 3 6:18

For an independent business in Chelmsford a very, very successful business, Yep, and sort of learned there, learn how to do buying, selling, obviously yeah sort of rolled with it, and now I've been doing Medsware for 12 years.

Speaker 2 6:32

Wow, I'm gonna rewind it then slightly, because what you've done with those questions is basically answered. The next three questions in one answer which is brilliant.

Speaker 2 6:41

No, because both of you, because you've saved me a job from asking it as well, yeah, yeah, to cut it down, I didn't really have anything, not this anyway not doing this and it and, and sometimes I start by asking that question just because I want to see if it's related or if it's linked to what it is you're doing now. But if you, if you're struggling to think of having, I don't know, those aspirations or dreams as a kid I didn't have any either. So if I was on a podcast being asked that I would, I would pretty much answer the same thing. Yeah, but some people I speak to.

Speaker 2 7:13

If you listen to my brother's one, yeah he knew from a very young age what he wanted to do, charlotte, who was on very similar kind of mindset. They were very driven into what they wanted to do early on. Um, okay, so I want to take, because you two, you two are best friends, aren't?

Speaker 1 7:29

you? Yeah, are you best friends? Yeah, I think I'm not going to test it at any point but, yeah, okay, so you've known each other since what age?

Speaker 2 7:35

when did you?

Speaker 3 7:35

meet secondary school. Yeah, well, yeah, we met when we were 11.

Speaker 2 7:38

Yeah okay, what? What secondary school did you go to?

Speaker 3 7:40

uh, we went to a lovely, lovely, sunny school called highland school beautiful, okay, yeah.

School Memories and Finding Oneself

Speaker 2 7:46

Yeah see, we're from different, we spell it s-h-r-t hole okay, okay. So what was your experience like at school then? So you met each other and we did you just click straight away, even in year well, we're talking year seven under your wing.

Speaker 1 8:02

Yeah, yeah, I was a little bit of a nerd.

Speaker 2 8:04

Okay, and what was, sam, if you were a nerd?

Speaker 1 8:10

what was Sam? Well, I mean, you know, you really liked David Beckham, didn't you?

Speaker 3 8:14

I loved David.

Speaker 1 8:14

Beckham back then you could probably say you had every haircut, every haircut.

Speaker 3 8:17

Skinhead Mohawk. Yeah, mullet, yeah, he was just like, like, you know, like both my ears pierced with big old fake diamonds.

Speaker 2 8:26

Really I cannot imagine that. Can we have some pictures?

Speaker 3 8:29

I look like a twat if you look back now to Moscow, I was imagining that.

Speaker 1 8:33

A twat with acne. Yeah, I mean, that's a good way of putting it.

Speaker 3 8:39

Yeah, but you clicked. Yeah, yeah, we saw, I met you through Skinner, didn't I?

Speaker 2 8:44

Yeah.

Speaker 3 8:45

One of our friends who we're still friends with now, and yeah, I thought Ed was, I must admit, very, very cool lad, like he was into the same music that my brother got me into, so either indie rock or, at that time, hip hop and grime and stuff like that. So we sort of clicked over that and also, to be fair, like clothes.

Speaker 1 9:06

Yeah.

Speaker 3 9:11

Was what we started connecting over without any romance involved. But yeah. So yeah, we started like I remember like when we used to get jeans from H&M, can you even? We used to rip them with Henry and stuff and try and mimic like the Levi 501 rib ones and stuff. Yeah, we used to do that and we used to rip them with Henry and stuff and try and mimic like the Levi 501 rip ones and stuff. Yeah, we used to do that and we used to get the same Nike dunks and stuff.

Speaker 2 9:29

Nice. So how was that perceived? Was that at your school? Because I'm trying to think back to me being that age and I was not into fashion. And if you saw pictures of me then you'd have fucking realised it as well. I don't think any of my friends were really.

Speaker 3 9:50

But was that a thing at your school or was that just a thing that you both shit did? You feel like you're a bit of outliers in that? No, I'd say. I'd say it was like our group really me, you, skinner and henry were. We got into clothes, probably to be fair, because my big brother okay, I keep doing what you said I keep looking at it, that's all right.

Speaker 3 10:01

Um, because my big brother he's four years older than me and he sort of showed us the way. He was like 16, well, 15, 16 when me and Ed met. You know he was at that age when he started going out like stuff like that, going underage to bars and stuff and dressing well, so we sort of got it from that, I guess. No, I wouldn't. I mean, you know, we had a little bit of that, but we were at the same time Chavs, really. You know, we, we did the Burberry socks tucked in jogging bottoms and stuff like that.

Speaker 3 10:29

I still went through that.

Speaker 1 10:30

Yeah, I mean I took it up a level I went for like the red Burberry socks, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 10:37

He'd always had a little bit up, oh nice. But your style, what you're saying is not as refined as it is now. No, yeah, I think yeah, yeah absolutely, but you go through those stages I did College. For me was, if I had to look back at pictures of myself and what I used to wear through college, I'd cry or feel really sorry for the person that I was looking at pictures of, because I used to dress like shit.

Speaker 2 11:02

It was so bad and no one was telling me that that I was. I think most. My mum used to do a lot of my shopping for me so yeah, that was that was my experience. But you go through those awkward phases like you said of course you know you go through the awkward phases to then learn what it is you actually want to dress like, look like, 100% style 100%.

Speaker 3 11:21

I think like that's the same for anyone though, john, especially if you're following fashions and trends like when we went to yeah, when I went to college and stuff yeah, I was just like an idiot, like the rosary beads and all stuff, that sort of style, those like Kanye West glasses when you go to a club and shit, yeah that's really cool man it's just supporting it.

Speaker 1 11:43

You're not the only one to be honest, though, I used to just throw stuff on. You know, Like whoa, they're multicolored. I'll put them on my feet. I didn't really care.

Speaker 3 11:51

Yeah, you've never really cared, have you?

Speaker 1 11:53

Yeah, I mean, you know, I care about some things. I love raccoons.

Speaker 3 11:59

I don't get the animal, but yeah, so yeah, going back to school, that's what we sort of, and we liked football as well. We played for the same football team, yeah and yeah, we started hanging out with each other all the time, yeah, went on a holiday together, didn't we?

Speaker 1 12:14

yeah, we did with my mum, my sister, yeah so that was a good bonding, that was a very good bonding time.

Speaker 3 12:21

Yeah, fond memories. Where did you go? Oh, I remember vividly that we listened to Don L Jones' album a lot. So what's that? We must have been probably 13. Yeah, something like that. Yeah, 13, 2003.

Speaker 1 12:33

Yeah, riding our bikes around the forest, you know, winding our hair. Where was it Nice? Yeah, man, a lot of nostalgia about it.

Speaker 2 12:43

Yeah, sounds good.

Speaker 3 12:44

And then we've been yeah like best pals ever since, until he left me.

Speaker 1 12:48

Yeah, I floated in and out, didn't I?

Speaker 3 12:49

Yeah, yeah, he was dead to me for a few years before he came back.

Speaker 2 12:53

What prompted the travel in the Ned? Why?

Speaker 1 12:59

I wanted to. Honestly, I wanted to escape. You know, I was still living at my parents' house. I didn't really know where I was going. Like I said, I didn't have a sort of pathway of what job I wanted to do. I was like, right, I went away for a year, did like proper traveling, like traveled to loads of places, and I was like, look, I want to go back to Australia. I love it there, you know, like it's the beach at your doorstep and like you just literally leave work and you meet all your mates and it just felt like fun. I guess I was stuck in that sort of now, looking back at it, it was amazing experience, but it was just like, again, I was escaping it. But I wasn't really escaping anything. I was just sort of floating around. I had long hair, didn't wear shoes, going to the servo getting a pie and just loving life, but um, describing this, what we're doing here.

Speaker 3 13:55

Yeah, this is making this sound very mundane. Yeah so?

Speaker 2 13:58

so what did you have? Brothers and sisters?

Speaker 1 14:01

uh, yeah, I've got I've got a younger sister and then two older sisters um, but it's quite a big age gap right um between the older sisters, but I mean, we, I still see them all the time.

Speaker 2 14:12

Yeah, I'm just trying to think with your. So your dad was kind of this example of someone that was very successful and ran a successful business. Yeah, you could have, by the sounds of it, gone into that route if you wanted to. There was opportunities. There was definitely opportunities.

Speaker 1 14:24

Yeah I was just I've. It sounds really corny, but that sort of free spirit, almost like I don't, I don't want to do that. Like yeah, you've told me that you know, like you've looked after me my whole life and now I'm like like no, actually I, I need to find my own way. Um, yeah, I like that. I think that's great, yeah I mean at the time I'm not sure that's how I felt about it like, but now looking back, it's actually yeah sounds good on the podcast I think, you're right, mate, it was that and it was good for you to go there, man yeah, so

Speaker 2 15:02

how long did you go traveling?

Speaker 1 15:03

for first stint was a year and then after that I was like two and a half years, right okay and when you came back, did you feel like you'd found what you were looking.

Speaker 2 15:13

Oh, that sounds corny, doesn't it? But like what you were looking for, did it do the job you were hoping no, no, not at all. No did it just kind of delay the inevitable, which was I need. I need to get a proper job, I need to get some money.

Speaker 1 15:26

I went for a job. So I was working for I did loads of stuff, but then I actually found a job that I actually really enjoyed. It was for being sports. Nice plug there. They're a sports channel across the globe.

Speaker 2 15:39

Looking for sponsors.

Speaker 1 15:41

And from there I was sort of like right, I'm enjoying this role. I really like the people I work with. I feel like I'm part of a family almost, and then we get on, we go out and but it's also work as well. Um, and I went for a role and I didn't get it. And then I was like, oh well, there wasn't any like what I didn't. I didn't plan for not getting the role right in my head.

Speaker 2 16:04

I'd already like I'm gonna get this, I'm gonna stay, it's gonna be amazing your first paycheck and everything yeah and I was like, well, now I'm just gonna spend all my money and fly home.

Speaker 1 16:13

And I did, and I and I got home and and, and I was like right, um, what do I do now? And then I I went, uh, I spoke to my brother-in-law, um, and he was like, look, I I've run, he was running a sort of multiple agencies and he sort of said like, why don't you like I'll give you a sort of job and if you like it, then you know like go from there, sort of thing. So I did like a couple of weeks with him and he was like, yeah, actually, you know, you're really good at this side of things, and I sort of fell into this project management role. I then ended up like working with people like Lego, mars and their global teams and it was, you know, it was good, but I didn't really feel like I was a part of the team that we worked with, but I didn't really feel like I was going to go anywhere with this.

Speaker 1 17:05

And that's what got me in even more of a rut and I was sort of going to see Sam all the time and just like, hey, you all right, sam, how's it going? And from there it sort of like clicked in my head. Actually there is something I wanted. I mean, I've always wanted in my head to sort of, I guess, run my own business, but like, yeah, be my own boss, because that way it's it's me, it's not like working for anyone else or following my dad's footsteps. And I think that's where it all sort of started to like click into place. Yeah.

Speaker 2 17:44

I think, speaking from my own experience and, sam, you probably attest to this as well, having worked for people for a good number of years there's a big element and the motivator for me to set up my own, which I just didn't want to work for anyone anymore.

Speaker 2 17:56

I just got so fed up, of sort of dancing to the beat of someone else's drum and even though and again, you, you can, I'm sure this resonates working for myself is some of the most acute stress that I've ever been through. It is my stress, it's self-induced. Yeah, there's variables I can't control, but I'm doing it for me as a direct response to the work that I'm putting in.

Speaker 3 18:22

Yeah, you get what you put in. Yeah, firmly believe it. Yeah, exactly, that's like when it, even when it gets incredibly stressful, like you've got to try and smile and yeah battle through it because, yeah, as you know, like it's, it's pigs and troughs, isn't it?

Speaker 2 18:36

yeah, is that. It's the awful rollercoaster cliche of everything. You can have a week, two weeks a month where everything is going in the right direction and just a few things fall out of place and you come crashing down again.

Speaker 1 18:47

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Starting a Successful Menswear Business

Speaker 2 18:49

So go on then, Sam. So you've been working in menswear for 12 years now 12 years yeah. So kind of bring me back to the stage then where you did, you guys, keep close as you went down your sort of separate career routes? Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, other than you buggering off.

Speaker 3 19:05

When we were in Australia, we were still always in contact, of course.

Speaker 2 19:09

Yeah, okay.

Speaker 3 19:10

And then Ed come back. I was working for a different menswear company as the menswear buyer Right and manager company, as the menswear buyer right um and manager um, and I was there for eight years. Fantastic business, very successful business, um. And then it was just time for me to go right in the end, ed wanted me to start, you know, start something ourselves. We didn't know whether to do online, just an online store, because it's like he can do e-commerce, stuff like that.

Speaker 2 19:34

Take me back to those. Then take me back to those conversations. How did that little, this idea that you had start to become the local merchants, where did that come from and how did it? A lot of pissed up nights together, yeah, um, chatting about putting the water right, yeah yeah, yeah, what we could do together and stuff like that.

Speaker 3 19:50

And it was always me who was, ed was well up for it and I've always been a little bit, a bit of a pussy, to be honest. I was like, look, I'm happy in my job, where I am at the moment, stuff like that. You know it's going well well, you're.

Speaker 1 20:04

Obviously there was the fact that you had a kid and then it was like oh, actually, it's like I've got to look after this little human being.

Speaker 3 20:13

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I just felt maybe a little bit stagnant in the end. So in the end I just felt maybe a little bit stagnant in the end. So, okay, in the end I just thought I've got to do it.

Speaker 2 20:22

So, ed, in a way was kind of like coming there and stoking that fire in you to say, come on, we can do this 100%, as well, as my wife drove me to to start something, yeah and it's the best decision I've ever made.

Speaker 1 20:36

I mean, I spent most of the money that was supposed to go towards the business just buying clothes from you to be like in the shop and be like are you sure you don't? That was your pitch, that was your way of just being in that environment all the time.

Speaker 3 20:49

Look how good I am. So, yeah, yeah, that's how it come about.

Speaker 2 20:58

It took, yeah, it took yeah, it took a while.

Speaker 3 20:59

So what? What clicked for you then to finally say, yeah, let's do it? Um lots of personal reasons, really, and I just felt like I did. I always had a drive of wanting to do something myself, um be part of something, not just work for someone you know.

Speaker 3 21:10

Um, and it just felt like the right time when I hit my my 30s and then I had a little boy, got a little girl down as well, just felt if I don't do it, if you don't take that risk, then what's going to happen? I'm still going to be doing the same thing in 10 years. Yeah, do you know what I mean? And yeah, I didn't want to have any regrets and I'm just happy.

Speaker 2 21:31

I went for it. It's a double-edged sword, isn it being a being a parent? Yeah, because you, you do have um a different type of responsibility. I'm not going to say more responsibility, ed, because I know you you've not got kids and I know there's a cat oh well, that's the same, but that's not. But it's a, it's a.

Speaker 2 21:52

I don't like cats but, anyway, I think it's a different responsibility in that I think some of those, the gravity of those decisions, yeah, I'm gonna leave the perceived security of it yeah, that's exactly what was holding me back the whole time.

Speaker 3 22:07

Yeah, okay, and then in the end we went for it and it took, yeah, probably about three or four months when we started setting it up and that's after about three or four months. That's when setting it up, and after about three or four months, that's when I realised, yeah, this is going to work. We've got faith in it. Working with Ed is fantastic. We trust each other. It was a bit of a rollercoaster though it is. Of course it is.

Speaker 1 22:31

I've been thinking about that even before that it was like I mean, is this actually going to happen, sort of thing. And it was like I mean, is this actually going to happen, sort of thing? And it was sort of ups and downs. And then at one point I was like it got to me, like I was like you know, if this doesn't go through, I don't actually know what I'm going to do.

Speaker 2 22:50

I need to go back to Australia. I can't keep doing this. So this, for you, was like a very conscious decision, that you were now ready to channel your efforts and energy into something that you knew you wanted to be yeah, I knew it.

Speaker 1 23:04

I knew it could be a success right I mean we still got like we've only been well. I mean we've been doing it two years, which is mental by the way.

Speaker 2 23:11

But mental, in what way does it feel like you've been doing it longer?

Speaker 3 23:14

no, you know what it is, mate. It's so strange because yes and no yeah like when I think of when we were like decorating the shop and stuff. We were doing it, or me and I did it all ourselves yeah, you know yeah to save costs and that seems like yesterday, yeah. But then there's certain times when I'm thinking about like I look at old, like stock on on our on, like our back database, I'm like oh shit, I remember that. Then that seems like ages ago.

Speaker 1 23:37

It's weird, yeah, I know.

Speaker 3 23:38

Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 23:39

Yeah, speaking from my experience, because I've been coming to see you guys since you opened.

Speaker 3 23:45

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it definitely feels like you've been, we're looking for a sponsor, our one and only customer.

Speaker 2 23:59

But it definitely you guys have been like a just an integral part of that part of lee road for for much more than two years, yeah, and now I think it's because you know, in part it's because of where you're situated you're next to cult coffee as well which those two places in terms of bricks and mortar premises on lee road. You just know them and like there's this, this sense of like.

Speaker 2 24:15

I don't know that. I don't know what it is. It's like a waypoint. Every time you walk past it there's this sense of like. I don't know what it is, it's like a waypoint. Every time you walk past it there's something really nostalgic about it, and you've been there for two fucking years.

Speaker 1 24:22

That's mad.

Speaker 2 24:23

And that's because of what you've created there.

Speaker 3 24:26

Thank you, mate. You should be super proud of that. That actually without sounding corny. We've said corny three times in this. Yeah, yeah, I've never said it on this podcast. That made me well up a little bit.

Speaker 2 24:35

Thanks, man I want to know a bit more about the process then. So you decide you get sam on board yes. You've got the buy-in yeah. What's the process then? So you go from having an idea of setting up a menswear shop. Where was lee the location?

Speaker 3 24:49

yeah, so, um, obviously I was at this business for eight years. Um, so in menswear, with certain brands and stuff, you, you have to be outside a 10 mile radius, so a lot of brands won't stop. Unless it's a big populated city like london, manchester, you can't, these brands won't work with you within 10 miles, understood. Um, so we had to think of somewhere outside of that zone, or we didn't want, I definitely didn't want to tread on my old employer's toes, so we went on recce's.

Speaker 1 25:23

We were going around Just having a bit of a jolly up. Was it always at a pub?

Speaker 3 25:28

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it was a bar crawl. What if we just opened up at this pub?

Speaker 2 25:35

Which is pretty much what you've done.

Speaker 3 25:37

Yeah, yeah yeah, obviously, we've had many a trip to at this pub, which is pretty much what you've done. Yeah, yeah, yeah, um, obviously we've had many a trip to Leon C, yeah, um, with friends, with family or whatever, and they'd been menswear businesses there before and a lot of them. Well, they'd all come and gone pretty much so it was always a bit of a red flag there, um, but in the end we just loved the area so much. We saw the shop we kept on having an hour in because we wanted the Broadway.

Speaker 2 26:02

Yeah.

Speaker 3 26:04

Because of, obviously, how much. It is a lot busier. Maybe not now, but it certainly was. Yeah, but then this shop we just slowly fell in love with it. I mean, it's a beautiful shop, as you know.

Speaker 2 26:15

Yeah, stunning Original windows and stuff. What was there before?

Speaker 3 26:18

I can't remember Partner's hairdressers. It was yeah, it was a hairdresser's.

Speaker 1 26:21

Still finding hair now.

Speaker 2 26:23

Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, I don't disbelieve that. Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

Speaker 3 26:29

That was there for God 40 years, I remember now the chairs and the like they had.

Speaker 2 26:35

I don't oh well, I'm doing a really bad job of describing it or like 80s.

Speaker 1 26:38

American pine, that was it wood.

Speaker 2 26:41

I remember a lot of wood in there, a lot of wood, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 26:44

Like brick feature wall yeah, with glitter in it. Very sexy, stunning, very sexy wall.

Speaker 2 26:50

Yeah, it was it was found this sexy wall in this, in this corner.

Speaker 3 27:01

Yeah, so we, uh, yeah, went in for the, you know, to take over the lease. Wow, um, and then just started buying stock, yeah, yeah approaching brands, um and like something that we've wanted to do since we started the business. Like we're, we're called merchants, we're called local merchants, which is funny because we're not actually that local. We should be called the localish merchants. But the store's local.

Speaker 3 27:19

That was the idea, but a lot of the brands weren't in the UK yet, so we wanted to represent them and be their first official stockists. We were approaching these brands. They're not in the UK yet and they're sort of like who the fuck are you? A lot of them like Burwitz Trousers, for instance which fuck are you? And a lot of them like Burwich Trousers, for instance, which is to this day our bestseller, if not our second bestselling brand, an Italian trouser company that had never been in the UK and wanted to break the market. And they started working with us. We approached them, we went out to Milan and started making meetings, buying stock, and then it was going to come in, I don't know, like four months later.

Speaker 1 27:56

Milan. It wasn't again a jolly up. It was a jolly up as well as fine stock Work and pleasure.

Speaker 3 28:03

But yeah and that's how it went. So.

Speaker 2 28:07

I'm just saying from the menswear perspective. You've, I guess, got the commercial expertise at this point.

Speaker 3 28:14

Yeah, I don't know if you can call it that. Well, yeah, I've been 12 years, or 10 years at that point in the in and around the market.

Speaker 2 28:21

So ed you're bringing the, the commerce and the design yeah, and the marketing side of things to the table.

Speaker 1 28:28

Yeah, I guess we're a multi-brand store, but in my eyes, when we were setting this up, is we need to make ourselves a brand, like the local merchants, like that needs to be the main. I don't know what's the word I'm looking for. It's yeah, dog, yes, yeah, I wanted to make it a brand, I wanted to make it personable to us. You know, like when we, when we were setting it up it's an experience, you know, I had to sell it all under this one thing it's not just we're a clothing shop that sells clothes. Yeah, yeah, yeah, like um again.

Speaker 3 29:10

It's like, like an experience as well yeah, yeah, I mean that is that we're about really yeah um is that the vision you had before.

Speaker 2 29:19

You know, when you went to Sam and you're knocking on his door and saying not literally, maybe you were, I don't know but you're saying to him right, come and sit.

Speaker 1 29:26

I guess I saw him in his environment Right Like it sounds crazy, but he's working and the way he's. We don't like to push clothes on people. No, we just want to dress people up because we want them to enjoy themselves and come out of it thinking oh you know, actually I don't need to wear these really skinny jeans or just a mixture of clothes that doesn't work yeah.

Speaker 3 29:52

And, like we were saying earlier, we'll look shit in 10 years.

Speaker 1 29:54

Yeah.

Speaker 3 29:55

Something that's relatively classic, that will look, look good, you know, no matter the time yeah um, and we've. We're very passionate about clothes.

Positive Shopping Experience and Business Partnership

Speaker 2 30:03

We love clothes, but at the same time, we love people and having them in the store and giving them a good experience yeah, I'm gonna just share an anecdote of the first time that I came into you, because I'd been recommended to come into the shop by jamie yeah, we're just naming shame, jamie milner, but because he'd been a client a client of yours for a customer of yours for a long, long time yeah, um, and yeah, jamie had recommended to come in and I and I hate jamie why I knew I shouldn't have left that.

Speaker 2 30:31

But I love you jamie, but I I hate shopping. Like I hate shopping for clothes. It's tends to be because I can never find anything that fits me. The experience has always been shit.

Speaker 3 30:42

And a lot of blokes are like that.

Speaker 2 30:43

Yeah, and there's nothing local. My experience with shopping was going definitely before I came to you guys was either doing it online and having to send everything back because the sizes were crap, or going to Lakeside or Bluewater, which is shit as an experience experience is just horrific to go around.

Speaker 3 31:02

Well, there's no personality in these like these big department stores and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 31:04

They don't give a shit no, exactly yeah they don't care if you go home and your missus says you look like an idiot in that you know like, and then you never want to shop there again.

Speaker 3 31:12

That's the opposite to what we wanted, we, you. It's all about building relationships, as you know.

Speaker 2 31:16

And well, this is it trusting us, because the moment I came in to to see you guys, I felt like it. You know it wouldn't have mattered to you whether I'd bought clothes in your shop or not, and that you know that might be because you were both incredibly good sales people. But I went in and the first thing you said was just like you know, do you want to drink? Come and tell us about what you're looking for. I think I'd even dropped you a message on instagram to say I'm coming in, can you help me? Yeah, look at this, this and this. And I walked out of there having spent a bit of money, but it just felt for the first time and I've told you this in in visits since felt for the first time that I actually enjoyed a shopping experience. But if you can convert me, who is anti-clothes shopping and hates that whole process, to be a returning customer, then you've got to be doing something right. In terms of that experience, that's a huge thing.

Speaker 3 32:04

Yeah, I mean a lot of it is we give alcohol to our customers.

Speaker 2 32:07

That helps. I think that helps Hit them with that Straight away they become weak.

Speaker 3 32:15

Yeah, it comes back to that experience thing, like Ed said a minute minute ago, not being pushy yeah so my first time I went into a menswear job, I remember being a young kid and going into that shop when I wanted a ralph lauren polo and it was like 60 off in this hour and shit right, and they are pushing on you or they're looking at you like you.

Speaker 3 32:37

you can't come in here, do you know what I mean? And that is the opposite to how shopping should be. You should come in, you should feel welcome, no matter what, no pressure, but if you need our help, we'll help you. We've got your size out the back in anything you want. Give a shout if you need us and then if you trust us, then we'll dress you.

Speaker 2 32:57

Which is exactly what you've done for me.

Speaker 1 32:59

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah people like you put all the clothes on and you come out and you feel, oh well, we'd like to think you feel great, but honestly, we see you and we're like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, like we dressed three people today in one was a groom, um, one was uh, had a a party on.

Speaker 3 33:22

Well, I say party, it was a send-off, but celebrating their father. And then the other was sadly for a funeral. But all of them, like we, were dressed in completely different outfits and they came out and they just went. I feel so good in this yeah, nice like I feel, mate, I mean, they all look tipped up, all completely different body shapes as well, and we just managed to give them a really good experience, I hope anyway yeah um and yeah, that that's what it's about.

Speaker 3 33:49

We love it like we'll take photos of them and then afterwards we'll put it on our socials like they look sick man yeah and yeah, we get a lot of buzz out of that no, that's so good.

Speaker 2 33:57

And that satisfaction. That is still the same, if not more, the longer the business goes on, you still get that buzz. When people walk out wearing you, wearing your stuff, I'm gonna sound like a god melt god, but I mean the first time that we put a sale through.

Speaker 3 34:12

Go on, I I started willing up yeah, I did.

Speaker 2 34:15

I mean, I'm a mate, I like that, it's a big, it's a big moment it was.

Speaker 3 34:20

Simon Bond, hello mate, absolutely legend. He did all the plants for our store and we put out just a few pieces of knitwear, hadn't we like on the rail, just to see what it looked like. The shop was still like a carcass, really a building site-ish. Yeah, yeah and then we've just got the tilt system in, haven't we? Yeah, I mean, we did.

Speaker 1 34:40

Oh, I see you pressing a couple of buttons yeah, yeah, yeah like this does that?

Speaker 3 34:44

oh, yeah, yeah, yeah scanner, like going in your eye and Simon.

Speaker 1 34:49

Simon busted through the door and he was like yeah.

Speaker 3 34:51

He was like oh, yeah, I love that. And I was like what? What? I was like, yeah, I'll have that, do you want this fight on? I was like no, no, I know that'll fit 40 years chest. I was like or 38, sorry, simon. And then yeah, yeah, and then put it through and I got all well done. I don't get like that with every sale yeah, I mean that's that emotionally draining.

Speaker 2 35:12

Yeah, yeah, emotionally draining.

Speaker 1 35:14

Where's Sam? Is he in the toilet again? No, actually he's out back weeping.

Speaker 3 35:19

Yeah every time, but I still get. I can't speak for him, but I'll get a big buzz yeah out of, especially when they put their trust in us to dress them in something like today like whole outfits you know, and they're just like what do you think looks good, where and where? And then they do it and they're like oh, that does look good.

Speaker 2 35:37

Yeah, I love that man.

Speaker 3 35:39

Nice. That's why I'm getting all excited.

Speaker 2 35:40

So you feel like it's mission, like almost mission accomplished in that regard, that you're providing that experience and people are now coming back Because it's the return custom, isn't it too? So you get people coming back through the sign of, yeah, what we did, yeah, I agree amazing. I was just going to ask you, like do you feel like there's elements because you are very different characters, like you can see why you're friends, but you're also different characters? I think that's safe to say so you mean what you mean.

Speaker 1 36:07

I'm not the really tall like laughy loud. Why are you doing this? Sorry, it's not a character but.

Speaker 2 36:16

but I think I think there's different elements of you. I mean, just listen to Sam, he's a loud guy and he's obviously got that confidence. And Ed, I think your confidence is just more understated is what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 36:28

Yeah, I'm not six beers in yet, that's true, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 36:31

I can imagine you'd catch up what's mental is.

Speaker 3 36:33

I was nervous as anything to do this today.

Speaker 2 36:35

Yeah, that's interesting. And Ed was like what St? I was nervous as anything to do this today. Yeah, that's interesting.

Speaker 3 36:38

And.

Speaker 1 36:39

Edward was like what Stunt cold killer Stunt, cold killer exactly. No, shaking with them hands. But yeah, I would agree that we're too.

Speaker 3 36:43

Yeah, but you, we are very different.

Speaker 2 36:46

Your personalities complement each other. So because if you were both, maybe like you or like you, that's not going to work in a business partnership.

Speaker 2 36:54

Yeah, yeah in a business partnership, yeah, yeah so. So I guess the point I'm trying to explore is as a business partnership. To date you've been really successful. You both just so happen to be best friends too. I'm just trying to think of how many times that does work. It's not I don't think that's a common occurrence that best friends end up starting a business, no, and then that can always be really successful.

Speaker 3 37:16

So I think it's because you've got different characters that you complement each other yeah, yeah, oh I yeah, 100 if we, if we were both me, jesus christ, I'd get on my own now I don't think anyone would be able to like hear anyone in the street.

Speaker 1 37:31

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, you said you can hear my laugh from down the road.

Speaker 2 37:34

Always mate the door's closed yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 37:40

I think it works. We're also we've had a rule since we started that if there's anything that annoys us, like we've done something and you've just nipping it straight away.

Speaker 1 37:50

You've got to communicate. Yeah, yeah, it's massive.

Speaker 3 37:53

Another thing is me and Ed are both as well, well, very like. We never lose our temper. Okay, if we have a disagreement about something, we discuss it, right, that's really good. It's the best way, otherwise, it won't work.

Speaker 2 38:05

Do you think again? That's a Otherwise? You get pent up. Yeah, there's resentment that builds and bubbles over. We are business partners.

Speaker 3 38:11

And the business is very, very important.

Speaker 2 38:13

But we are best pals first. Right, that was one thing I was going to ask, because the dynamic shifts at a point, but the way you prioritise is best friends first.

Speaker 3 38:24

Yeah, yeah, well, that's how I. I mean, we've never had that exact discussion.

Speaker 2 38:28

It's just an interesting comment, because I get the sense that that's the case. But, it's interesting because, going into business with your best friend, there is a risk that those lines can be blurred at times, but you sound like you've got the right dynamic there yeah, we are friends first, of course we are now that's very, very important.

Speaker 1 38:45

I mean listen we we as I say, we've always said that if something goes wrong, like ed has I probably annoyed ed a, lot, lot more than he's annoyed me.

Speaker 3 38:55

He barely annoys me he works at the moment because I've got two little kids. I'm not there as much as ed is. I mean, I still, we still both of us do six days a week. It's a rarity that we'll do five days a week because, right, you know, we've only been open two years and you're open seven days a week.

Speaker 3 39:12

We're open seven days a week yeah we've got two members of staff as well okay um, but I think for the first five years in a business, me personally, I think, like the, the, you know the whole you. What do you call it Like life and work balance?

Speaker 2 39:28

Yeah.

Speaker 3 39:29

I think that you've got to put as much into work as you can. Personally. For it to work, yeah, but that being said, I'm still trying to spend as much time as I can. Yeah.

Speaker 2 39:37

I was going to ask then, because that leads to the question like how it sounds like you've got a really supportive other half and obviously your kids are young as well, but how does how bought in? Are they? So you said, Victoria, at the time where Ed was saying we need to start this business. She was banging the drum to do it too so it sounds like you've got that support at home to say go and do that.

Speaker 3 39:56

My family, victoria's family, ed, of course yeah but Victoria's very supportive still like very understanding yeah, great, you need that, don't you?

Speaker 2 40:06

because if you've got that resentment at home, yeah, I wouldn't be able to do it without that, but yeah, that being said, I still get one weekend day off with them every week and I get to bath them every night. Yeah, nice.

Work-Life Balance and Business Growth

Speaker 3 40:18

So I see them a lot more than a lot of dads would, but it's six days a week. You know, obviously, the trips we go oh, it's such a chore. We go to, uh, like florence and milan and stuff. We're gonna go into amsterdam soon and but that does you know. You're away from your family, and then she's looking after two little kiddies and when, when I'm not there and yeah, I have to look after you, I guess you know, and then it looks after me.

Speaker 3 40:42

Yeah, at least you don't have to look after a big baby, but yeah, yeah, nice.

Speaker 2 40:47

So there's that dynamic shift then. Isn't there between sort of your, I guess you're you're at home, your hands on dad, you're a parent and you're a partner, and then you come to work and you get to invest your energy in something that you, you enjoy doing yes, yeah, yeah, I enjoy, but I love being at home, but I love being at work too yeah, it's both very lucky because this is.

Speaker 2 41:06

This is something that, because you talk about work-life balance and this is this is um addressed at both of you, but I think I'm I'm of the same mindset. Everyone goes on about work-life balance, which is subjective. It's going to be completely different to anyone that you speak to their version of what it looks like it's going to be different.

Speaker 3 41:22

You think it's 50 50 in your own business?

Speaker 2 41:24

then that's bollocks well so my, the whole motivation for me starting up on my own was to get a better work-life balance. After I had my son and he was one, and I set up the business and then I think, zooming out, I've had a better work-life balance.

Speaker 3 41:39

If you zoomed out over the space of nearly five years now it's been better. Yeah, definitely.

Speaker 2 41:44

And it's my own stress, it's the own pressure I put myself under. But yeah, stress, it's the own pressure I put myself under. But yeah, I would never say that, get trying to get the work-life balance.

Speaker 3 41:54

If that was the aim I fucked up like, it hasn't given me that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You won't have a successful business if you're doing 50 50 with.

Speaker 2 41:59

But this is a really good point because I think a lot of the narrative now from from people that are, um, like we're against hustle culture now, so hustle culture is a bad thing. You know, know, working I don't know 14, 15, 16 hours a day is a bad thing, always trying to make sure you're looking after yourself and don't sacrifice your wellbeing is a bad thing, but without an element of sacrifice, how the fuck are you going to grow something? How are you going to make it successful?

Speaker 3 42:23

I still think there's not enough hours in the day for what we do. I know it looks like we don't do much, but we do a lot. Of course you do yeah, non-stop.

Speaker 1 42:32

You know we're always trying to grow it, and I do. You know what, even from the podcast with dean, there's things that ella, my partner's been saying to me that I know deep down that we should have done already, but I now think we're in a better space for it when it comes to more goals or milestones and stuff like that. Um, and you know, putting that pressure on myself, I mean it doesn't help if we had the sale comes in and it goes ding and then you're like oh okay, so it's an online sale you're talking about.

Speaker 1 43:00

You get notifications coming through, yeah, and then you're like, oh okay, you're right, um, we need to sort that out. And then you switch back on again. But I try to generally, when I get home, switch off, but then I know that we've got stuff coming up and then all of a sudden it starts to unravel again and I'm like, right, I need to build up on this plan that I've put in place. It's not quite right. So, yeah, actually I probably don't really switch off. I like to think in my head that I do, but when you actually think about it it's no.

Speaker 3 43:31

You know, like yeah, I mean you, and you won't mind me saying this you do. You build it up in your head a lot like what? We have to do, whereas I'm still like we were talking about when I was in school, where I sort of plodded along bare minimum right I don't do the bare minimum now, obviously, but ed is very and it's good because I need it. I'm not that's where you compliment each other again 100% we compliment each other in a lot of ways.

Speaker 3 43:53

I'm a pessimist, ed's an optimist. Hence that's why the business come, because he wanted me to crack on and I was like oh no, it could fail, and then, and then you know, he was the one who got me there. And then there's like recently we ordered. Well, I say recently last year, remember when we ordered 30 shirts right of this, just one style. 30 of them Right. I've never ordered 30 of something in my life.

Speaker 3 44:19

Right the most I've probably ordered is about 15 of one style, okay. And he's like, just fucking, do it like that. And I'm just like, no, I don't know what to do, but he'll push me to do it. You see, we ended up having 100% selfie on it. They all went, but without him I wouldn't have done that.

Speaker 3 44:34

At the same time, I'm not very organised Ed's organised, but you'll build it up in your head you've got so much to do, whereas I'm like we'll get it done, don't worry, we do tend to get it done, but there's a lot, like Dean said on the podcast, we could probably organise that a bit better, and that is a lot my fault, to be fair. We could sit down and say you know, we want to do this by this date, that by this date.

Speaker 1 45:02

I think a big part of that is those like we've never run a business before yeah, of course man, we're still learning and we were like you go into and I'm like, oh, you know, I've worked, like I said, work with brands and stuff and I've project man at this and done that, but actually when it comes down to it's like, well, you know like I need I need to be right like is this gonna work or is that gonna work? I don't know. You know yeah, and then what an amazing thing.

Speaker 2 45:26

Do you have any mentors or guidance or anything beyond the experience that you both got to help steer this? That's terrifying. Yeah, I know you've been to, haven't you?

Entrepreneurship and Business Growth

Speaker 3 45:36

and then we're still open like Sam Giles has got chin chin and toppers and toast. Yeah, yeah, he's become a very good friend of ours, like he said. We were sitting down the other day. He said would you say you're entrepreneurial? I'm like no, not at all, I just like clothes. I like talking to people. I like buying and selling. That's it. I wouldn't say literally in sixth form. I went to do business and they said absolutely not You're doing drama or something like that. We're just worrying, but for some reason we're doing all right.

Speaker 1 46:11

Maybe we're just worrying, but for some reason we're doing alright. Maybe it's the thrill though, the risk taking, like there are certain risks that I'm like, yeah, actually that's not a great idea, but like, actually it's like if we don't do this, yeah, well, like we said earlier, if you don't do it, you know you're going to lose the cliche is that you'll learn from your mistakes.

Speaker 2 46:23

Yeah, as long as it's not a catastrophic mistake that you're making, if it's mission critical then, well, that's the thing, we do play it, we play it safe.

Speaker 3 46:31

I think you have to especially in the first five years.

Speaker 2 46:33

Yeah.

Speaker 3 46:34

And we have been playing it safe. Yeah, and it's working so far.

Speaker 2 46:38

Tell me then, can you share one of the biggest mistakes you've made in business or one of the biggest lessons that you've learned? Maybe I think I worded it as mistake to Dean and then I reworded it as lessons. So what do you reckon one of the biggest lessons have been? You can both have one each. You don't have to agree on it.

Speaker 1 46:54

Maybe not doing it sooner. Well, yeah, you say that not doing it sooner but then like pandemic.

Speaker 3 47:02

Yeah, yeah, that would have killed us. That would have killed us.

Speaker 1 47:05

No, yeah, that's a good point.

Speaker 2 47:09

Yeah, have you fucked up at any point? Have there been fuck-ups along the way? Oh?

Speaker 1 47:12

yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, Sam had just had a baby and it was, you didn't drop it.

Speaker 2 47:19

No no, no, no, no. I'm pretty good with kids Come on.

Speaker 3 47:22

Yeah, he is actually.

Speaker 1 47:23

But no, it was the summer, it was hot. We'd ordered a lot of shorts and they hadn't come in yet and the shorts that we did have had sold. So I'm like, scrambling, where can I get stuff from? And I was like, look, colorful Stands is great. So I went straight on their system and I ordered loads of navy shorts. Yeah, they weren't navy.

Speaker 3 47:44

They're still fucking sitting out of bed.

Speaker 1 47:48

Bright electric blue blue that I like they're nice they are nice.

Speaker 3 47:52

I do like them, but we didn't need about 30 of them yeah, you buy a small in that and you're not working. Maybe you know you'll sell loads of them maybe you won't sell that many electric blue, that's yeah, but if that's our biggest mistake, you're doing alright, you're doing all right.

Speaker 2 48:05

Yeah, I'm trying to think.

Speaker 3 48:07

And then, of course, there's been lots of, but they're all little mistakes yeah, you know what I mean. Like there's nothing that I'm like oh my god, jesus, that's, that's massive.

Speaker 2 48:15

I think yeah well, don't I mean don't struggle to search one if it's if you're two years. No, if you're two years in I'm not saying it because it makes for a good, a good soundbite, but yeah, I just think people be interested if, if they're going through the same experience. You're going into this having never set up a business before and you can be two years down the line and not had like a, a fuck up. That's big enough to come into your heads right now that's pretty, that's pretty good going.

Speaker 3 48:40

Yeah, I wouldn't say like a nothing that catastrophic.

Speaker 2 48:43

Like jesus, like so I'd be then inclined to say, when you're resisting that label of entrepreneurial or being an entrepreneur, actually there are a lot of elements or a lot of boxes that you both check with that.

Speaker 3 48:57

Yeah, no, well, yeah, we obviously are. You do I mean by?

Speaker 2 49:00

definition by default you are checking those boxes and you're doing it well.

Speaker 3 49:05

Yeah, like I don't know what the exact definition in the dictionary is of a, of an entrepreneur, but we're looking to grow it all the time. We'd like to expand it at some point um, so I guess we are entrepreneurial.

Speaker 2 49:19

This is the question, because maybe some of the strategy that you play out in your head sometimes is getting other premises or getting a bigger shop, whatever that looks like. What are the plans for the business moving forward? Can you share anything?

Speaker 1 49:32

I mean, right now, it's just sort of like getting a few more seasons under our belt, growing it that way. You know, we've built a team. There was just two of us, now there's four, there's three, now there's four of us and we do take the slow and steady approach, but we're always thinking about other things. We've got a collaboration coming up which is two months two months yeah, about that we want to expand but we're not in a hurry yeah, we

Speaker 2 50:05

as we say this is two years, but that's a really measured approach to take, isn't it? Because I guess you're in a, you know, financially you're in a position maybe where you could explore that as a potential route if you wanted to. If you, because some people drive to their measure of success isn't about making something stable, it's about getting more shops or getting more signs on the door, I mean listen.

Speaker 3 50:25

we and also I I think you were speaking to Dean about this, about him and Asa. The boys, of course, are fantastic, our staff, but the shop is still seen, as me and Ed we are the faces of it.

Speaker 2 50:39

We are the business.

Speaker 3 50:41

And for us to go off now and start, like you know, looking for other premises and putting loads of effort into that and we're never in that shop. I think that would be detrimental.

Speaker 2 50:51

What's it been like hiring people to come and represent your brand Honestly?

Speaker 3 50:56

piece of.

Speaker 2 50:58

We've been so lucky. You're going to make a lot of people jealous, I know.

Speaker 3 51:01

I know, listen, and the day we do expand, I know.

Speaker 1 51:05

It's going to be tough.

Speaker 3 51:06

And it can be tough, but we got Charles who works for us, and he's just amazing, he was your first employee.

Speaker 2 51:13

Yeah, he's fantastic he's listen he.

Speaker 3 51:15

There's nothing about men's where he doesn't know it makes us look like idiots.

Speaker 2 51:18

Right, come on, man, if you can do it anymore yeah, he's just great.

Speaker 3 51:24

he works for New Inlingwood in Uptown German Street. He was there. He ran the store for 10 years. Wow. And then Ben Rajab Do you know Ben?

Speaker 2 51:32

He's just started. Yes, I do know Ben. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course he went to the wedding, the wedding yeah, yeah, yeah. The wedding, the wedding, yeah, yeah, I don't know, why we said it.

Speaker 3 51:43

Like you know, he's got the gift of the gab. He's so easy to work with.

Speaker 2 51:47

Yeah, brilliant, yeah. So you've had, you've had a like a real you know lucky streak there with with hiring two people that have gone have gone.

Speaker 3 51:56

well, do you mind me asking Cause, would you? Would you like to have staff? Yeah, would I like to have staff.

Speaker 2 52:01

Yeah, so my first employer, which is a big step for me moving forward as well, because I promised I'd never do it. Oh, really, yeah, I hate managing people.

Speaker 1 52:13

I hate people.

Speaker 2 52:14

I'm an arsehole to work for. Ultimately, that's always been my opinion of myself as a manager is that I'm a control freak. So you can't let go yeah exactly, and this is why I ask from a hiring perspective. You guys birthed this business into life. You've been the face of it. Trusting people to represent a brand that is associated so closely with you is a big deal. Oh yeah, it's a big deal.

Speaker 3 52:42

And it is nerve-wracking, but you've got to have trust in the people you do and I have confidence in me and Ed and how we choose people. We really think about it. It's not like we don't just go in.

Speaker 2 52:55

Just drag someone off the street, you'll do. Come on.

Speaker 3 53:01

And we do have quite a few applicants that come in and stuff. So we really do knuckle down and think who?

Speaker 2 53:08

can we trust who's right for the?

Speaker 3 53:10

role and who can we trust?

Speaker 2 53:11

I think the nice thing about you two as well is that you've developed this brand, which is beyond just the local merchants. It's your own personal brand too. So I think you're going to filter out some people that maybe won't come and work for you, and that's a good thing. That's a really good thing and that's why I advocate for a lot of the businesses I work with. You've got to like. Some people that maybe work in your line of work will see your videos on TikTok and they'll see your videos on Instagram and they'll think how can?

Speaker 2 53:38

they market clothes like that. The clothes that people are coming in and spending a good amount of money to buy. I absolutely love it, but that attracts me into your shop and it will alienate people that don't want to come in and and be associated with a brand like that but that's a good thing, that's a positive thing able to capture yeah, yeah, you can't please everyone and that was all wed's idea yeah, it's brilliant, it's so good menswear is like especially classic menswear well right, I say that with invert congress, congress, you know, like jackets, tailored trousers.

Speaker 2 54:11

There's a stigma around it and how it's marketed and everything I mean me and Ed go to parties.

Speaker 3 54:15

Now we laugh because we overhear conversations that these blokes are talking about and they're like oh, they're talking about whether you should have a dimple in your tie or not.

Speaker 2 54:24

And they take it so seriously.

Speaker 3 54:26

We were literally at a party Someone was talking about that Three blokes outside. One of them had an umbrella over his arm like that, and it was like ha ha ha. He looked like he was from the Victorian ages. He looked cool, but I was just like ah.

Speaker 2 54:36

And then I turned around and I'm like where's Ed?

Speaker 3 54:38

And there's a little toy dog in the window next door and he's going hello.

Speaker 2 54:44

Yeah, we love the clothes, the clothes at the end of the day.

Speaker 3 54:48

We like that they'll look cool in 10 years still and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 54:51

But it's just covers, man, you've got to have a bit of fun.

Speaker 3 54:54

Yeah.

Speaker 1 54:55

I mean, it is serious. You know it's your life, it's your work, but if you don't enjoy it, then it's never going to work.

Speaker 2 55:04

It comes across, it really comes across.

Speaker 3 55:06

yeah, let's just say we ain't in it for the dough, but we, I love it. I love going to work yeah. I absolutely love it. Me and Ed just have a laugh all day. We work hard, no it's brilliant and eat too much yeah, eat too much and a lot of chilli sauce yeah, a shit load of chilli sauce right we're nearing the end really we're nearing the end. Oh man, I'm just getting warmed up.

Speaker 1 55:25

Yeah, and I think I might have remembered what I was going to say.

Speaker 3 55:27

Oh, yeah, no, no no.

Speaker 2 55:33

Right, one of the running themes on the podcast this season has been people based in Leon C businesses that are based in Leon C.

Speaker 2 55:37

So creatives, entrepreneurs or business owners in Leon C? Yeah, it's been something I've been exploring as to why there's such a high number, high concentration of people in this neck of the woods that are ticking those boxes. Do you think, first off, that I'm making sense with that? Do you think that is a thing I mean? You've named a couple of people whose name I can't remember now. Sam, Sam You've named Sam as being he's a prime example of someone that runs a number of businesses in Leon City. What is special about this area that, first off, attracts people to operate businesses here.

Speaker 1 56:15

I personally think it's community. You come in, people accept who you are. You're not this really laughy guy and this guy you know six foot, six foot one, six foot one handsome, but you know like six foot, six foot one, six foot one, handsome. But you know like we fit in love our neighbours. We love Jamie.

Speaker 3 56:34

Love Jamie. Have you had Jamie from Vino Vero on.

Speaker 2 56:36

Yeah, he's been on. His episode's coming out in a couple of weeks. Yeah, I make him jump every day. Really I love it, you know we make a point of going, going to every restaurant to eat to it, you know there's some that we haven't yet, but we make sure supporting local.

Speaker 1 56:56

Yeah, you know, like when we do our photo shoots, I said to sam it's like it's all good having in the shop, shops, nice and stuff, but why not do it in other businesses? One we promote our clothes and you can promote them at the same time. It's just like it makes sense, yeah, yeah, so it's like, yeah, to promote the community.

Speaker 3 57:13

I mean, we obviously live in, we live in Chelmsford and it feels very different there, mate. I love Chelmsford, I don't but it's very, very different independent driven. I mean Costa got booted out. I don't know if I can say that on your podcast.

Speaker 2 57:29

Sorry, mate, you can believe me, no, you can say that they're not a sponsor, not a sponsor yeah, because people just didn't want to work with them.

Speaker 3 57:35

Yeah, didn't want to work with them. Didn't want to go in and get their coffee from them, because all the coffee shops they're nuts for one you know they're family owned. Yeah, and that's what drew us to it, because it is like a little pocket of just a completely different feel to the rest of Essex, I feel anyway.

Speaker 2 57:56

Yeah, I think that runs in a similar vein to what a lot of people have said, but usually I'm speaking to people that have grown up around this neck of the woods. So what was it like then? When no one's going to be running at you with pitchforks. Are they saying, get the fuck out of Lee, because you're from Chelmsford?

Speaker 3 58:11

a few people yeah, I mean we upset people a few people. Really not like that. Like there was someone who was on the door when we were about to open and he was like looking up, looking up and he bet he weren't joking, he was being dead serious. I was like alright, sweet mate, and I was like fuck off anyway, he's been back and spent really yeah.

Speaker 1 58:38

So, yeah, you converted him. He didn't hate it that much. Yeah, but no, to be fair, everyone's been very welcoming.

Speaker 3 58:45

Honest, we were talking about this the other day, weren't we? I think we we may not have worked as well, maybe if we.

Speaker 1 58:50

Yeah, we were from there. Yeah, if we were from here, I don't, I don't think, I don't know if we work as well, yeah well, every community has like politics or whatever.

Speaker 3 58:58

Yeah, yeah, um, yeah like two new faces two new faces so friendly.

Speaker 2 59:03

Friendly like loud, chatty lads and no, but you want to support a new business that comes in with that attitude.

Speaker 3 59:08

Yeah, we have no connections here.

Speaker 2 59:10

No, we just came and and you haven't developed a click, because that is I think that's one of the downsides that has been stated on some of the episodes that haven't necessarily aired yet, but some of the clickiness sometimes that you'll get in small pockets, but that happens, you know.

Speaker 3 59:30

But that happens, you know that happens, but we're very, very conscious of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, um, keep on saying it, um, but dean's one about being therapists.

Speaker 2 59:35

We, we, are therapists yeah, of course, on the test of that, yeah talk to you.

Speaker 3 59:40

We we like we like to if we can help out, you know. But we will never, ever ever tell anyone what we are told in the shop. You can't.

Speaker 1 59:48

Table of trust. Yeah, exactly, it's trust.

Speaker 3 59:52

It's a relationship and there's lots of different people. Some people might not like each other in Lille.

Speaker 2 59:58

No, I don't care, you'll get it wherever you go, though, won't you Little pockets of community there?

Speaker 3 1:00:04

Exactly, and, yeah, we're very conscious of that, so community.

Speaker 2 1:00:09

if you had to sum it up in one word, it's community.

Speaker 1 1:00:11

That is right, mate definitely community feel they want you to succeed because if they, if we succeed, they succeed. Yeah, brilliant, you should get that.

Speaker 2 1:00:21

Thanks, that'd be. That'd be the soundbite Ed you've just made the soundbite. You've forgotten half of what you were going to say, but that is going to be the soundbite.

Speaker 3 1:00:30

At the same time, who wants to see empty shops on the high street? There's too many of them now and it's a real shame.

Speaker 2 1:00:34

The nice thing is you've got Lee Road and the Broadway and, yeah, there's a couple that pop up as empty every now and again but they fill pretty quickly with independents coming back in. I feel weird calling it a high street, but it is for all intents and purposes it's.

Speaker 3 1:00:48

Leeds High Street, isn't it? Yeah, technically it is, but, as you said, it doesn't feel like that. No, yeah it doesn't, and pretty much every shop you want to stick your head in and go and look at don't you Exactly that?

Speaker 2 1:00:58

yeah, Because it has personality.

Speaker 3 1:00:59

It's not just a phone shop or whatever. Do you know what's that one? Let's talk about that. Do you know what I used one the other day?

Speaker 2 1:01:10

did you seriously, yeah right because my take on it is I've never, I've never expected they were going to green light phone shops on Lee Road and now there's two in that stretch. I'm not sure how you know how they?

Speaker 3 1:01:24

I don't think, I think that's it yeah, well, they just go in one night squatters, boom, commercial squatters, and it's impossible and people are just like whatever, yeah fair.

Speaker 2 1:01:36

Yeah, I do. I mean, yeah, I've got my own opinions about Lee, but I think a lot of them are positive, a lot of them are really positive. Well, if we are the last, one.

Speaker 3 1:01:47

Can you mention it or?

Speaker 2 1:01:47

not. What about the ones that aren't so positive?

Speaker 3 1:01:50

No, it's just your thinking of it.

Speaker 2 1:01:52

Yeah, it's a good point, because I said that at some point in this season. I want to try and wrap it up with like a conclusion. This won't be the episode where I do it.

Speaker 3 1:01:58

I hope you don't, mind yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 1:02:02

I just thought we had the other one. You know charlotte sayer.

Speaker 3 1:02:05

So charlotte owns the boundaries.

Speaker 2 1:02:08

Yeah, yeah she's awesome, like her episode was great and the response to it has been brilliant. But she she was the first person to say about community and that, and that collaboration, like her big driver, is that she wants to help people succeed and and the nice thing about lee's that you can connect people within two names and there may be a way to make money, a way to support a small business or even start a new one, and that's what I like about it. So it's collaboration and community are probably the two words that I'm coming closest to to describe, like, why people come here and why people are successful here. Um, yeah, maybe, maybe I'll do a little epilogue episode that covers the bits of the community that aren't so great.

Speaker 3 1:02:49

Yeah, brilliant, I can't wait to hear it.

Speaker 2 1:02:53

You're going to have that anywhere and it's going to be completely subjective, because it's just my fucking opinion. It's my podcast. Do what I want, right, gents? Do you know what You've been? I knew this was going to be fun anyway, and you are honestly two of my favourite people you've not been in my life for long.

Speaker 2 1:03:13

But I just want to say thank you as well, because you've given me a load of support in the very short time that we've known each other on a personal level, and that's been that's meant a lot to me so thank you for that, thank you for giving I'm on here. Oh no, thank you. If I'd done a podcast and not invited you on and I was doing it this I'd be crucified, yeah.

Speaker 3 1:03:31

I mean, you know, are you getting your mum's question up now?

Speaker 2 1:03:35

Yeah.

Speaker 3 1:03:35

Hey, so this is usually the test when people go.

Speaker 2 1:03:38

We've listened to episodes. I get to this point and go. I've got a closing tradition.

Speaker 1 1:03:41

And then I go like this they go shit, you haven't listened to the whole episode. Is this creepy? Does she have blonde hair? No, what the fuck. Oh, okay.

Speaker 3 1:03:54

What's wrong. I'm going to cut our cereal, kiddo, cut that.

Speaker 2 1:03:58

Right.

Speaker 3 1:04:02

So, oh Jesus, we are. I can't turn my laugh down, can't.

Speaker 2 1:04:06

I no, you're in. You're locked in now, right, right. So mum's question. So yeah, the closing tradition of the podcast is is that mum asks a question for you guys. Now she knows roughly who you are and I don't listen to the question, okay, before she sends it, so hi sam and ed I wonder if you could answer this question on behalf of John's other half, Sophie.

Speaker 1 1:04:31

How much does he actually spend in your shop? Thanks very much, bye.

Speaker 2 1:04:36

It's the laugh, it's the evil laugh.

Speaker 1 1:04:38

I know I mean like you know we've got a table. We trust it. Yeah, I was going to say you obviously can't say a figure of what.

Speaker 2 1:04:46

I spend Thanks for that, Mum.

Speaker 3 1:04:51

I'm a good customer. Yeah, I'm a good customer. He is a good customer there you go.

Speaker 2 1:04:55

Yeah, he's a good customer. Thanks, mum.

Speaker 3 1:04:57

Right, anyway, I can't just say you sound lovely, you sound lovely and blonde. Oh no, we're not getting into this, we're not getting into this, we're not getting into this no, he's a very, very good client of ours, and you don't have to be a good client just to spend a lot of money yeah it's about just as long as you're a nice person and you trust us.

Speaker 1 1:05:21

Coming back in having that chat, you know, like, where we are there to help you? Yeah, in a multitude of ways.

Speaker 2 1:05:27

Yeah, well, look, thank you so much. I'm going to help you, yeah, in a multitude of ways.

Speaker 1 1:05:30

Yeah.

Speaker 2 1:05:30

Well, look, thank you so much. I'm going to let you get on with your evenings and thank you for sacrificing a lot of your night.

Speaker 3 1:05:35

Don't be silly, mate. It's been our pleasure. You're a legend. Cheers, mate.

Speaker 2 1:05:37

Thank you so much.

Speaker 3 1:05:38

Cheers.

Speaker 2 1:05:39

Thanks for listening to Jobsworth. If you enjoyed this episode, please feel free to like and subscribe. Stay connected by following me on LinkedIn for more insights on the world of work behind the scenes, content and updates on upcoming episodes.